Jul 302012
 

In my last post about sex bots and VR sex, there was some talk about how governments might start banning internet porn.  That might be something that various governments try to do although I doubt such laws will pass.  Even if such laws do pass, there are still plenty of ways around it.  For example, porn servers could be located offshore.  Not all countries would ban internet porn.  Even if governments tried to ban porn server IP addresses, there are tools to get around them like proxy servers and TOR.

If you want an example of how porn servers would survive when a government bans them, take a look at The Pirate Bay which still survives despite all of the legal challenges against it.

With better and better 3D graphics, it will be possible soon to create porn on your computer that looks completely realistic.  It won’t matter if you can’t download internet porn.  You will be able to create your own porn on your own computer.  This is what will eventually become VR sex.  Technology in general in moving to an area where you can create things yourself bypass any laws that might exist in the process.  Recently, a gunsmith was able to build a gun using parts created by a 3D printer.  One of those parts was the lower receiver of the gun which is the legally controlled part.  With a 3D printer, anyone will be able to create guns without a license bypassing any laws that might stand in the way in the process.  There is going to be no stopping this since governments aren’t going to be able to ban 3D printers.  There is just too much money behind them and too many businesses who want to use them to reduce manufacturing costs.

It’s similar with porn and VR sex.  The movie and TV industry wants to be able to computer generate photo realistic movies and TV programs.  The video game industry wants to create photo realistic video games.  Both of them need virtual humans indistinguishable from real humans to do this.  Those industries will spend the billions of dollars required to get there.  They already have spent billions of dollars on this just to get us to the point we’re at now with computer generated TV and movies and video games.  Like how the government isn’t going to piss off industries with many billions of dollars behind them to ban 3D printers because they can be used to make guns, the government isn’t going to piss off the the movie/TV industry and the video game industry just to be able to ban porn.

These technologies are coming and in the end, government isn’t going to be able to stand in the way.

  21 Responses to “Working Around The Law”

  1. I put sexbots in the same realm as the “singularity” and immortality.

    Everything thinks that stuff is just around the corner.

    Right.

    We’re in a period of collapse and decline. The golden age is ending, the infrastructure isn’t being maintained or upgraded.

    Even assuming that a lifelike sexbot is built, it has the same problem normal women have versus porn.

    The sex bot is expensive (and so to women) and need to be maintained (so to women) while porn is cheap and you can look at another women very easily (men are visual and like different visual stimulation) which is a problem for woman and a sexbot would have trouble with.

    Remember the Concord? Faster, cooler, more status, but it couldn’t survive against the more affordable, less classy, less comfortable atlantic flights.

    You can counter with the “3D virtual reality sim porn” but the argument on expense still holds.

    You’re right, there will always be porn, but the rest is just a stepford fantasy for replacing women

    • Ras Al Ghul wrote:
      We’re in a period of collapse and decline

      Certainly some things will collapse and decline – it’s the price we pay for the disruptive technologies that are unfolding.

      I’ve noticed there’s a certain species of online troll that fetishizes the impending collapse of society (Paul Ehrlich is their archetype). So they naysay any type of development that would undermine their fantasies.

      The sex bot is expensive (and so to women)

      If it’s in the price of a mid-range vehicle, that’s still far less expensive than a woman would be. Also, there would be a guaranteed cap on expenses – a robot isn’t going to put you in prison for false accusations of rape or clean out your bank account before presenting you with divorce papers.

      You can counter with the “3D virtual reality sim porn” but the argument on expense still holds.

      No it doesn’t, if it’s built from cheaply available components. The availability of 3D printing will virtually guarantee that this will be true.

      • While I enjoy the implied insult of calling me a troll with a fantasy about the end of the world, let me very blunt here. The “sex bots” won’t undermine the collapse, it will hasten it if it occurs because it would only encourage less male participation is society and civilization absolutely depends upon men to maintain it.

        So you assertion that I would be against the sexbots because it counters my “dream” of collapse is logically on its face untrue.

        The ones living the fantasy are the ones “dreaming” about how women are going to feel when the shoe is on the other foot and men don’t want them and don’t “need” them because they have a sexy replacement in the form of a robogirl.

        And it is a fantasy that men in the manosphere relish, the “comeuppence” they imagine women will get.

        My point is that it is cost based. Simple porn is more than sufficient to satisfy most men (including and perhaps especially married ones) and so the sexbotopia isn’t going to happen.

        And the “3D printers” guaranteeing this to be true makes me laugh. Tell my, Ray, what time table do you see this happening in?

        Porn is to the sexbot what the concord is to the economy flights. We fly in the same basic planes we have flown in for 50+ years. The same roads.

        The same, and this is important, power and infrastructure of the last fifty years which is decaying. (you think those new light bulbs are to save the environment? They’re not, they’re to keep the system afloat because they don’t have the money or ability to improve the grid)

        Cars with computers in them . . . and they last no longer than the old ones did and use the same amount of gas per mile. Expensive hybreds don’t save you money or make life better. We have digital movies that are no better than the old style way of doing things (and often worse)

        I remember as a kid being told that we would be a “paperless society” that it was inevitable because of technology.

        This is the revenge fueled dream of the overlooked beta.

        • Ras Al Ghul wrote:
          While I enjoy the implied insult of calling me a troll with a fantasy about the end of the world,

          It’s always nice to see someone enjoying himself. So, do you jerk off to apocalyptic porn or not?

          let me very blunt here. The “sex bots” won’t undermine the collapse, it will hasten it if it occurs because it would only encourage less male participation is society and civilization absolutely depends upon men to maintain it.

          As in “Don’t Date Robots?” Certainly there would be short-term upheaval and drastic social change due to the presence of sex robots. But it doesn’t follow that would make it the end of the world.

          Humans have faced incredible threats before such as the Black Plague. Yet we prevailed.

          And it is a fantasy that men in the manosphere relish, the “comeuppence” they imagine women will get.

          Yes, one manosphere prediction is that technological advances will scale back women’s sexual and social power drastically. What makes you think it won’t be an accurate prediction?

          My point is that it is cost based.

          So, you’re saying that men won’t be willing to invest in the equivalent of a midrange flat-screen home entertainment system in order to get their sexual needs met? If so, I’d say the burden of proof falls very heavily on you.

          Simple porn is more than sufficient to satisfy most men (including and perhaps especially married ones) and so the sexbotopia isn’t going to happen.

          If your point had any validity, Pac-man would have been a “good enough” experience 30 years ago and we would never have made it to World Of Warcraft.

          And the “3D printers” guaranteeing this to be true makes me laugh. Tell my, Ray, what time table do you see this happening in?

          10-40 years seems reasonable. 10-20 years for the home adult entertainment systems, 20-40 for the sexbots.

          These systems could be made of only off-the-shelf components, custom-made 3D printer components, or a combination. I don’t really care how it’s done, but PMAFT’s larger point stands that they’ll make banning sex-related technologies effectively impossible.

          Cars with computers in them . . .

          Yep. Now Google has a self-driving one. Are you telling me that’s not going to be a disruptive technology?

          and they last no longer than the old ones did and

          They’re better, safer and less expensive than the old ones. Much of the “stasis” you see is an illusion generated by the relatively greater improvements in information technology. Not to worry; ubiquitous computing will allow us to meld the rapid advances in that field with manufacturing.

          use the same amount of gas per mile.

          Bullshit. Even simple fuel injection systems raise the mpg drastically. They’re directly responsible for turning the oil crisis into an oil glut in the 80s. At 12mpg we were in trouble; at 22mpg OPEC got a bloody nose and gas dropped below the price of bottled water.

          I remember as a kid being told that we would be a “paperless society” that it was inevitable because of technology.

          The reduced need for paper is actually starting to happen now. Sometimes predictions aren’t so much incorrect as late.

          Porn is to the sexbot what the concord is to the economy flights. We fly in the same basic planes we have flown in for 50+ years. The same roads.

          http://www.singularity2050.com/2010/06/the-carnival-of-creative-destruction.html is a excellent essay on emerging technologies of the 21st century. It navigates a decent middle ground between the stasis you claim we’re going through and starry-eyed optimism (i.e. technology will solve everything that I find equally annoying).

        • The ones living the fantasy are the ones “dreaming” about how women are going to feel when the shoe is on the other foot and men don’t want them and don’t “need” them because they have a sexy replacement in the form of a robogirl.

          And it is a fantasy that men in the manosphere relish, the “comeuppence” they imagine women will get.

          This is the revenge fueled dream of the overlooked beta.

          I’m actually a bit surprised that there isn’t more resentment on men’s part. For the past half century or so Western women have attempted to restrict male sexuality as much as possible while removing all civilized constraints on their own. It cannot end well.

          If you want to understand the anger of men like Eivind Berge look no further.

    • No one has said that sex bots are “just around the corner”. You’re missing the forest for the trees. The fact is that substitutes for women are increasingly getting better and less expensive. Just because you can’t get a sex bot next year doesn’t change this fact.

      As for the expensive, even if a sex bot cost $100,000, that still would be cheaper than a real woman.

      • The fact is that substitutes for women are increasingly getting better and less expensive. Just because you can’t get a sex bot next year doesn’t change this fact

        I’ve already seen Youtube uploads where guys use the Kinect to feel up the boobs of a virtual woman. Anyone who doesn’t see where this technology is heading is just being willfully ignorant.

  2. I think interactive software will be the kill switch, if people are paying for aps to stoke virtual cartoonish cats imagine the response to a virtual woman.

  3. Everything I said is wrong, nice hyperbole.

    Can you ride in the concord now?

    Yes/no

    Can you take a suborbital flight (the tech has been there for decades) yes/no?

    Do people play full Virtual reality 3d games like they said they would 20 years ago? yes/no

    Do 90+% of the people still play video games and watch tv on a flat (granted it was a tube) 2d screen? yes/no

    Despite the computers and everything else, do people drive the same way to work as they did 40 years ago? yes/no

    Are we a paperless society like futurists promised forty years ago? yes/no

    You’re a sci fi writer (because that’s what a futurist is) and like all sci fi writers you get wedded to your vision of the future.

    You guys don’t get it, the sexbots and vr reality aren’t going to change things, because they already changed with internet porn, men are already dropping out of society for the cheap alternative, these techs aren’t going to make an appreciable difference in that process.

    And with the dropping out of males, California’s descent into barbarism is just the start for the rest of the nation.

    • Everything I said is wrong, nice hyperbole.

      Funny, it looked to me like a simple statement of fact. You basically denied the ample technological improvements that have occurred just because they don’t match up to the Jetson’s version of it.

      Can you ride in the concord now?

      No, it’s an impractical, obsolete technology which was justifiably retired.

      Can you take a suborbital flight (the tech has been there for decades)

      Give it 10-15 years. We can now go into space for a fraction of the cost it would take at the time of the moon landing.

      Do people play full Virtual reality 3d games like they said they would 20 years ago? yes/no

      Similar time frame to above. And we’re light years beyond what was possible 20 years ago.

      Despite the computers and everything else, do people drive the same way to work as they did 40 years ago? yes/no

      No, now they videoconference in and use remote desktop services.And self-driving cars are already available – it’s only a matter of time before they take over. Or do you deny that this will happen?

      There’s even telepresence technology available, although it isn’t yet widespread.

      http://spectrum.ieee.org/automaton/robotics/industrial-robots/051810-anybots-qb-new-telepresence-robot

      Are we a paperless society like futurists promised forty years ago? yes/no

      It’s taken longer than predicted, but computing is starting to have an effect on reducing the need for paper.

      you’re a sci fi writer (because that’s what a futurist is) and like all sci fi writers you get wedded to your vision of the future.

      One not-so-subtle difference : his predictions are near-future ones, so it doesn’t take that long to figure out whether he’s accurate, full of shit, or somewhere in between.

      You guys don’t get it, the sexbots and vr reality aren’t going to change things, because they already changed with internet porn,

      Yeah we do, because the internet porn will soon acquire an extra dimension and a good enough haptic interface to accurately simulate the girlfriend experience. So your statement should be rephrased “they started to change with internet porn”. It’s a long way from being finished.

      men are already dropping out of society for the cheap alternative

      Men drop out of society for a variety of reasons; you can hardly blame it all on easily available porn. It probably makes living downwardly mobile existence more bearable. Men who might have turned to crime or revolution in other eras get absorbed in porn or video games.

      And with the dropping out of males, California’s descent into barbarism is just the start for the rest of the nation.

      Gee, they’re all going to fall like dominoes? Does that include areas as disparate as Utah or Vermont?

    • Can you take a suborbital flight (the tech has been there for decades) yes/no?

      Yes, you can for enough money.

      Do people play full Virtual reality 3d games like they said they would 20 years ago? yes/no

      Yes. In fact I do this myself with a 120 Hz monitor with 3D vision glasses and headphones connected to a soundcard that outputs surround sound.

      Do 90+% of the people still play video games and watch tv on a flat (granted it was a tube) 2d screen? yes/no

      I don’t know the percentage, but the technology for playing video games in 3D is available and affordable.

      Despite the computers and everything else, do people drive the same way to work as they did 40 years ago? yes/no

      No. We have GPS, and now cars that can parallel park themselves are commercially available.

      Are we a paperless society like futurists promised forty years ago? yes/no

      Compared to 10, 15, and even 5 years ago, we’re a lot closer to it.

      The only thing you were right on is the Concorde which is impractical, obsolete, and suffered from a bad business model rather than a lack of technology. What you are doing is equivalent to complaining about a lack of cell phones in 1990, when they were available, just not widespread.

      • I wanted to comment on the cars thing as well. I learned to drive pre Anti lock breaks up in canada.

        They taught us to pump the breaks on ice and snow so as not to lock up and start an uncontrolled skid? Do they still teach you to pump the break so that the steering wheel still responds?

        I may be showing my age, but it does drive my daughter nuts when I pump anti lock breaks on the ice instead of just standing on them like she was taught. Funny that eh? Or that I steer into a skid on ice.

        ( cause, as Im sure you know, pre ABS breaks,, holding down the breaks locked the wheels up so you couldnt steer them, so you have to pump and lock the wheels in a position that was ok to slide in or youd actually start the car spinning. you knew that, right?)

        Thank god nothing has changed there. Driving habits havent changed, but the tech sure as hell has.

        Ill do another one. Porn was easily available in my youth. We had to steal if from our parents or the store, but it was around to be had if you wanted ( pre internet even!) Its odd how the porn has gotten both better and worse from my perspective. Yet strangely, I dont generally find my self seeking out the porn of my youth, I actively seek out the porn of RIGHT NOW. Cause its, you know, better.

  4. And one last thing. “Moore’s law” is nothing of the sort.

    A guy notices a pattern and you want to make it a “law”

    You are making the logic error of assuming that everything is going to continue the way it has been. It cannot and won’t.

    Thirty years ago if California had been a separate nation\, it would have been one of the top ten richest and most productive countries in the world.

    Look at it now.

    That is the future you’re looking at. And the sexbots wouldn’t make the inevitable backslide any less likely to happen.

    • And one last thing. “Moore’s law” is nothing of the sort.

      A guy notices a pattern and you want to make it a “law”

      Could be because it’s continued uninterrupted for about 50 years. Also, Moore’s Pattern” simply isn’t quite as catchy.

      You are making the logic error of assuming that everything is going to continue the way it has been. It cannot and won’t.

      And just where is he doing that? I have no illusion that technology will continue on its merry way forever. Constraints imposed by the laws of physics put a ceiling to human capabilities. But within those limits there is still vast room for improvement.

      Thirty years ago if California had been a separate nation. it would have been one of the top ten richest and most productive countries in the world.

      Look at it now.

      That is the future you’re looking at

      Your point being? California != the whole world. One place going south doesn’t mean everywhere else will follow.

      And it’s a huge state; if all of it had gone to crap, I’m quite sure the author below wouldn’t still be living there.

      http://johntreed.com/Review-of-How-to-Retire-Overseas.html

      Why don’t you stick your neck out and give some specifics of what’s going to happen over the next 10 to 20 years (like others have).

  5. they can’t make it illegal, but women will still find a way to ramp up the volume of their shaming.

    however, I think we have already gone past the point of no return as far as women’s value is concerned.

  6. I think the increasing risks associated with trying to meet women, particularly in the feminist countries of the west, are going to drive more men to seek alternative solutions.

    In France a woman can now have you arrested for looking at her in the wrong way, or “leering” as they call it. She can dress like a total whore and go out to a public place, and still call the police if an unattractive man notices her and tries an approach.

    http://www.rt.com/news/sexual-harassment-law-france-561/

  7. Do people play full Virtual reality 3d games like they said they would 20 years ago? yes/no

    Yes. In fact I do this myself with a 120 Hz monitor with 3D vision glasses and headphones connected to a soundcard that outputs surround sound.

    Well, I wouldn’t call this type of setup “full virtual reality,” but, in my opinion, it’s definitely an improvement over monoscopic displays and stereo sound.

    There are visors on the consumer market that can fill your vision with the images, but they tend to be 720p or lower resolution. I’ve seen an upcoming consumer product with 1080p 60FPS per eye at CES 2012, but I’m not sure if it’s out yet.

    The point is, the tech to provide Ras Al Ghul’s “full virtual reality 3D” experience is continually improving in capabilities and price.

    I purchased a 3D Vision setup in January of this year and have been very happy with it. In fact, I got involved with a fellow looking to start the world’s first 3D game review site. I create video reviews, presented in stereoscopic 3D.

    Needless to say, we completely disagree with Ras al Ghul that S3D will remain fringe over the near future.

    PMAFT, if you want some 3D content to watch on your 3D Vision setup, please check out my work at s3dgamerzone.com. I have created most of the videos there. I’m completely self-taught when it comes to video production, so the quality of the first reviews I did are (very) rough, but the more recent ones are much better.

  8. I left a number of comments at Heartiste’s Sexbotopia post and got into a debate with a poster. I argued that sex substitutes would be much more satisfying for men than for women; he disagreed. My last post is on the bottom.

  9. These technologies are coming and in the end, government isn’t going to be able to stand in the way.

    Will 3D printers also be able to “print” a line of coke? That would be great hey! Men should stop thinking in terms of workarounds. If the fems want us to stop breathing, some men think they’re clever because they’ve figured out how not to breathe (photosynthesize or something). Prohibitions are prohibitions, regardless of the Internet. Prohibitions work, alas!

  10. Regarding your first point, I suspect if that VR sex rises even to the level of 3D anime with a decent haptic interface, it will have a lot of takers. Of course it’s going to go far beyond that level.

    As to the second, agree 100%. Search costs matter so much that even a clearly inferior substitute (2D computer images) can be a force to be reckoned with on the sexual market. What they lack in realism they compensate for in convenience and variety.

    My guess is the emotional connection factor will always be there, but its urgency for men may vary with the transactional cost of sex. In other words, the less time/money a man needs to expend looking for sex, the less likely he is to be emotionally “needy” or to confuse the need for sex with the need for love.

    VR sex will definitely shift the balance of power by 30% or more. And beyond the sexual factor, trends in automation are now affecting the work favored by women. Maria Shriver’s “woman’s nation” is very unlikely to be a long-term phenomenon.

Leave a Reply to Ras Al Ghul Cancel reply

Translate »
%d bloggers like this: